Well, it was a huge amount of data all those copies. I bought a map of the whole Northsea and plotted all courses as entered in the reports.
Also plotted the patrol areas and minefields.
Her last patrol is rather difficult to plot, hence there is only the coordinates issued from England, ORP Orzel kept radio silence.
If I assume that she was able to get to the rendez-vous point with HMS Trident, but she arrived late so HMS trident had allready left the rendez-vous point, ORP Orzel's orders would bring her back to Rosyth.
If you draw a straight line from the rendez-vous to Rosyth, then minefield 16a would be in her path. It is likely that she was then lost in that minefield.
This minefield or minefield 16b may be also the resting place of H.M. O-13.
Another assumption is that regarding her radio silence she had troubles with the radio. Or she was sunk by a mine close to Rosyth. This is also feasable because the Germans where laying mines along Britain's east coast i that period or prior.
My conclusion is that any point along her course to the ordered positions she can be found. It requires a lot of time and money to follow that course in an effort to locate the boat.
regards,
Paul Konings
BTW: All information that is out there would be much appreciated.
HM Submarine "Trident" was exchanged by ORP "Orzel". "Trident" surfaced at 22:49 on the 2nd of June and proceeded for Rosyth. As HMS "Trident" crossed the "Orzel's" path (sector A-1) sometime between 6-8am on the 3rd of June, "Orzel" was already N/E of that "crossing". They couldn't interfere unless "Orzel" was late on the patrol...for example, being bombed but survived on the 28th of May. "Trident" went straight and "missed" the 16a minefield by several miles south (she was so "lucky"...!!! ...or the British knew exactly about the minefields. Ask for ORP "Wilk" patrol (Jepgs are good resolution) and draw her June patrol down. "Wilk" went half way between 16a and 16b.
The 16b minefield is a target little without a proof. It was first mentioned in a letter (1960s) from a Naval-History office stating that the "Orzel's" path lead straight East from Rosyth and reached 16b minefield. Now we know the info from the British office was not true. The path was different. The return path of "Orzel" is not known because the orders simply ... disappeared. The Navies only "suspect" the return path crossed 16b minefield and came up with the 57N 3.40E position.
I agree that "Orzel" leaving sector A-1 could theoretically get on 16a minefield going Northbound...
Kind regards,
Tomasz Kawa
Edytowany przez Tomek dnia 03-05-2007 23:53
...or the British knew exactly about the minefields. Ask for ORP "Wilk" patrol (Jepgs are good resolution) and draw her June patrol down. "Wilk" went half way between 16a and 16b.